Re: [FSF-WG] Re: Proposal for publishing a statement urging especially educational institutes to adopt free software for video conferencing
We had a meeting to finalize our stand on videoconferencing systems. We got the following draft which we consider as final. I request Siddharth ro publish it on FSF India website.
Thanks!
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Title: Better than Zoom and Google Meet: Try these Free Software powered video conferencing apps and services
We recommend you to use free software https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw powered video conferencing software like Jitsihttps://jitsi.org/ and BigBlueButtonhttps://bigbluebutton.org/. Since they are free software, the software is under user's control, and they give the user the freedom to run their own server which gives users full control over their communications.
We would like to highlight that the FOSDEM 2021 conference which used only free software (Matrix and Jisti) and hosted 30,000 attendees https://matrix.org/blog/2021/02/15/how-we-hosted-fosdem-2021-on-matrix which shows that for large conferences also we need not depend on proprietary software.
Problems with proprietary videoconferencing systems
In the pandemic time, our communications are being held via nonfree video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc.[Link to point 1 of Further Reading section] Hosting video conferencing via non-free software gives away control of our communications.
Video communications on Zoom are done via Zoom's central server which mistreats users in various ways such as snooping on users https://web.archive.org/web/20210104084812/https://www.vice.com/en/article/k7e599/zoom-ios-app-sends-data-to-facebook-even-if-you-dont-have-a-facebook-account and shutting down accounts of activists https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/jun/11/zoom-shuts-account-of-us-based-rights-group-after-tiananmen-anniversary-meeting. Zoom also censored an event with Palestinian activist Leila Khaled and other events criticizing its censorship https://theintercept.com/2020/11/14/zoom-censorship-leila-khaled-palestine/. A Zoom executive reported on users to China, and snooped on meetings https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/12/18/zoom-helped-china-surveillance/. If they discussed the Tien An Men Square massacre, he terminated the meetings and the participants' accounts, on the orders of China. What made it possible is that Zoom's design lets staff snoop on every conversation as it passes through the server. Further, Zoom's developer has done a lousy job in protecting your privacy https://citizenlab.ca/2020/04/move-fast-roll-your-own-crypto-a-quick-look-at-the-confidentiality-of-zoom-meetings/.
Surveillance and censorship are the consequences of the power Zoom has over its users because of its nonfree software and centralized server. It is Zoom's unjust power over their users that we oppose. This power bring users at the mercy of the entity(Zoom in this case) providing the service. The same is true for other non-free conferencing systems like Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, Skype https://stallman.org/skype.html etc.
Nonfree programs should never be trusted for privacy even if they say that the communications are end-to-end encrypted. It could send the unencrypted version to the owner of the software when asked, bypassing the encryption. A company that sold encryption systems to 100 countries was controlled by US and German intelligence, [and the equipment spied on the governments that used it]https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/feb/11/crypto-ag-cia-bnd-germany-intelligence-report which means that you should never trust a proprietary encryption code to protect your privacy . Therefore, we suggest you to reject any nonfree/proprietary software.
How can free software powered video-conferencing systems solve the problem?
If the users communicate using free software installed in a server controlled by the users or a server run by a trusted service provider, they get full control over their communications. This gives them control over the policies of the service and data collection. With Free Software like Jitsi and BigBlueButton, you have a choice of service providers, and you are not forced to host your video meetings on any particular server, say, Jitsi's central server. You can also host the service in countries with better Free Speech laws instead of forced to follow only Chinese law, in case of Zoom. This is like dissenters taking refuge in other countries to avoid persecution by oppressive governments. Jitsi instances usually have maximum capacity of 70 participants at a time. A list of Jitsi instances is here https://wiki.chatons.org/doku.php/la_visio-conference_avec_jitsi and a list of BigBlueButton instances is here https://wiki.chatons.org/doku.php/la_visio-conference_avec_big_blue_button. We did not try all the instances mentioned in these links. This is just a list for users to try different instances. We suggest you to read the policies of the servers before hosting your communications there.
Autistici's Jitsi instance https://vc.autistici.org/ supports recording without using Dropbox or any other nonfree software service (other Jitsi instances usually require a Dropbox account) and live-stream without using YouTube (other services usually support live-streaming with YouTube only) on their own server. To record your meeting on Autsitici's server, you can click 'Start Recording' when you want to start and after 'Stop Recording', you will be sent a link in the Jitsi chat, and you can download the recording in your device.
Jitsi instances like 8x8.vc has an Indian dial in (not toll-free but a number in Mumbai) number to join the audio conference. So people with unlimited talk time but not a good internet connection can also join these.
https://tube.tchncs.de/ and other PeerTube instances that support live-streaming can be another option. https://joinpeertube.org/instances has a list of PeerTube instances and you can filter the list by choosing 'Video maker' profile and 'Yes' to 'And do live streams' option. Apps like NewPipehttps://newpipe.net/ and Fedilab support watching PeerTube videos and live streams. OBS https://obsproject.com/ can be used to stream classes live.
BigBlueButton instances generally have more capacity than Jitsi instances and instances like https://meet.nixnet.services can scale up to 270+. Mixed approach of live-streaming and using separate text chat for questions can increase the limits. BigBlueButton supports white board, presentations, live-streaming on YouTube. We suggest you to avoid live-stream on YouTube. BigBlueButton doesn't need any app on mobiles to work, people can simply join via any web browser. Chiguru also runs a BigBlueButton server https://classmeet.chiguru.tech/ especially for online classes and includes paid plans according to your needs.
Conferences conducted using only free software
In the pandemic time, we also saw the successful organization of conferences using only free software. FSCIhttps://fsci.in/ and Free Software Foundation of Indiahttps://fsf.org.in/ conducted Free Software Camp (https://camp.fsf.org.in) entirely using Big Blue Buttonhttps://videos.fsci.in/accounts/fscamp/videos. Conferences DebConfhttps://debconf20.debconf.org/about/debconf/ and MiniDebConf Online India 2021 https://wiki.debian.org/DebianIndia/MiniDebConfOnlineIndia2021 were also held using Jitsi and Vogol for live-streaming the conference and Etherpad + IRC chat were used by the audience to ask questions. Free Software Foundation<fsf.org> conducted their annual conference 'LibrePlanet' in 2020 online [without the use of any nonfree/proprietary software] https://www.fsf.org/blogs/community/libreplanet-2020-in-person-component-canceled-but-well-see-you-online. The FOSDEM 2021 conference was conducted using only free software which hosted 30,000 attendeeshttps://matrix.org/blog/2021/02/15/how-we-hosted-fosdem-2021-on-matrix which shows that there is absolutely no reason that [any online conference should require proprietary software] https://sfconservancy.org/blog/2021/feb/08/just-say-no-to-zoom/.
Add this screenshot here- https://matrix.org/blog/img/upload_07145dc9cf8d5ae22b6eaf91a63dd8d6.jpg
The article uses the term 'FOSS' which stands for 'Free and Open-Source Software' which we avoid because we stand for freedom and therefore prefer 'free software' over 'FOSS'. Any organization seeking to run a conference can either hire their own people, hire some of the people who organized FOSDEM to deploy the technology for you. If they can host their conference using only free software, other organizations can do it too.
Educational Institutes should switch to free software
Educational institutes all over the world are conducting lectures/webinars via nonfree software. We suggest educational institutes to adopt free software alternatives like Jitsi, BigBlueButton and avoid nonfree software for lectures and conferences. Conferences can be held using only free software similar to the above mentioned conferences. Educational institutes have a responsibility towards their students and teachers to respect their freedom and privacy. Students should not be forced to give away their freedom and privacy to attend lectures, webinars to build their career.
If you are from an educational institute, and need help in switching to free software services which respect your freedom, we will be glad to help you. Please do not hesitate to contact us in this regard https://fsf.org.in/contact.
Ways in which students can resist
To show rejection of nonfree software, students can resist in various ways. Students can get in touch with each other and send collective letters to teachers or their administration to create awareness about the problems that proprietary software poses. To raise awareness, they can share this article. They can ask their teachers to make recordings from the Zoom calls and post the recordings where they can download them later. We suggest free software like upload.disroot.org or PeerTube for sharing video lectures. Or else ask teachers to post the pertinent visual materials so that students can get them before the class, and they can record the audio themselves. That way they can attend the classes without running any nonfree program.
Students can also set up kludges to avoid running nonfree video chat programs. For instance, the teacher (or one student) could point a camera at a screen showing the Zoom call, and stream that camera and mic to the students who want to stay off Zoom. There can also be a kludge for them to speak and send their voice to the Zoom call.
How to start and join a meeting via Jitsi and BigBlueButton?
Find a Jitsi service that suits your needs https://wiki.chatons.org/doku.php/la_visio-conference_avec_jitsi and create a room with a random name or a name that you can remember. Share the meeting link with attendees. Joining a Jitsi meeting is as easy as clicking a link and loading it in your browser(Recent versions of Chromium and Firefox) or Android or iOS Jitsi Meet apps and does not require creating any accounts. Jitsi meetings can also be password protected so that only invited attendees can join.
Find a BigBlueButton instance that suits your needs https://wiki.chatons.org/doku.php/la_visio-conference_avec_big_blue_button and sign up for an account. Once you are logged in, you can create rooms and share the links with attendees. Joining a BigBlueButton meeting is as easy as clicking a link and loading it in your browser (Recent versions of Chromium and Firefox) either on your laptop/desktop or on your mobile.
Need help? Contact us
If you would like to switch to free software powered services like Jitsi and BigBlueButton, and you need help in this matter, feel free to contact us here https://fsf.org.in/contact. We would be very glad to help you.
For further reading:
[1] Members of UK parliament were forced to use Zoom in order to vote https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/apr/20/mps-expected-approve-plans-virtual-parliament.
[2] Americans are getting evicted because they could not attend a court hearing carried out via Zoom https://www.npr.org/2020/06/19/880859109/zoom-call-eviction-hearings-they-ll-throw-everything-i-have-out-on-the-street.
[3] Why Schools Should Exclusively Use Free Software https://www.gnu.org/education/edu-schools.html
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[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
The article would be more effective if you cut the size by 1/3. I think it is possible to do that without losing any of the points.
Aside from that, I have two specific points.
We would like to highlight that the FOSDEM 2021 conference which used only free software (Matrix and Jisti) and hosted 30,000 attendees https://matrix.org/blog/2021/02/15/how-we-hosted-fosdem-2021-on-matrix which shows that for large conferences also we need not depend on proprietary software.
Please cite LibrePlanet first, for two reasons:
1. It used only free software in 2020 already.
2. It is a free software event, whereas FOSDEM is not.
In the pandemic time, our communications are being held via nonfree video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc.[Link to point 1 of Further Reading section] Hosting video conferencing via non-free software gives away control of our communications.
Video communications on Zoom are done via Zoom's central server which mistreats users in various ways such as snooping on users
The first thing to criticize about Zoom is that the client program is nonfree.
The first thing to criticize about Zoom is that the client program is nonfree.
The article says "In the pandemic time, our communications are being held via nonfree video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc.[1] Hosting video conferencing via nonfree software gives away control of our communications." Didn't we already criticize Zoom on the basis of nonfree software client?
[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
The article says "In the pandemic time, our communications are being held via nonfree video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc.[1] Hosting video conferencing via nonfree software gives away control of our communications."
Indeed, that says Zoom is nonfree.
That text shows an example of a way of speaking I think we should try to avoid. The text says that "our" communications are done using these nonfree programs. That implies that "our" communications are done over nonfree video conferencing.
I hope we don't all do that. I at least don't do it. I have never used Zoom and never used Google Meet.
To say that "we" use the nonfree software suggests the idea that "It's inevitable, so we all surrender to it, of course." That encourages the readers to give in.
Let's tell people, instead, "We don't have to do this the unjust way. It is possible to resist!"
Indeed, that says Zoom is nonfree.
That text shows an example of a way of speaking I think we should try to avoid. The text says that "our" communications are done using these nonfree programs. That implies that "our" communications are done over nonfree video conferencing.
I hope we don't all do that. I at least don't do it. I have never used Zoom and never used Google Meet.
To say that "we" use the nonfree software suggests the idea that "It's inevitable, so we all surrender to it, of course." That encourages the readers to give in.
Let's tell people, instead, "We don't have to do this the unjust way. It is possible to resist!"
What do you think about changing
"In the pandemic time, our communications are being held via nonfree video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc.1 Hosting video conferencing via nonfree software gives away control of our communications."
to
"You should never use any nonfree software and that applies to video conferencing software too, such as Zoom, Google meet and Microsoft Teams etc. Any nonfree software is an injustice to the user because it does not give users freedom and takes away control of their own computing. Users do not control a nonfree software. Being nonfree software is enough reason to reject them. The initial injustice of proprietary software often leads to further injustices: malicious functionalities https://www.gnu.org/proprietary/. " ?
And then we can add in the next line "Video communications on Zoom are done via Zoom's central server which mistreats....." , the following "In addition to Zoom's client being nonfree" so that we get the line
"In addition to Zoom's client being nonfree, video communications on Zoom are done via Zoom's central server which mistreats....."
That would criticize Zoom's nonfree client.
[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
"You should never use any nonfree software and that applies to video conferencing software too, such as Zoom, Google meet and Microsoft Teams etc. Any nonfree software is an injustice to the user because it does not give users freedom and takes away control of their own computing. Users do not control a nonfree software. Being nonfree software is enough reason to reject them. The initial injustice of proprietary software often leads to further injustices: malicious functionalities https://www.gnu.org/proprietary/. " ?
That text makes it good. However, a smaller change would also make it good. The problem I am pointing out in
"In the pandemic time, our communications are being held via nonfree video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc.1 Hosting video conferencing via nonfree software gives away control of our communications."
is very specific. It is simply that it asserts that "we" _are_ using the nonfree programs.
[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
"You should never use any nonfree software and that applies to video conferencing software too, such as Zoom, Google meet and Microsoft Teams etc. Any nonfree software is an injustice to the user because it does not give users freedom and takes away control of their own computing. Users do not control a nonfree software. Being nonfree software is enough reason to reject them. The initial injustice of proprietary software often leads to further injustices: malicious functionalities https://www.gnu.org/proprietary/. " ?
That text makes it good. However, a smaller change would also make it good. The problem I am pointing out in
"In the pandemic time, our communications are being held via nonfree video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc.1 Hosting video conferencing via nonfree software gives away control of our communications."
is very specific. It is simply that it asserts that "we" _are_ using the nonfree programs.
That text makes it good. However, a smaller change would also make it good. The problem I am pointing out in
"In the pandemic time, our communications are being held via nonfree video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc.1 Hosting
video
conferencing via nonfree software gives away control of our
communications."
is very specific. It is simply that it asserts that "we" _are_ using the nonfree programs.
What about changing the line to "In the pandemic time, a lot of people, organizations and educational institutes are communicating via nonfree video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc "?
[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
What about changing the line to "In the pandemic time, a lot of people, organizations and educational institutes are communicating via nonfree video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc "?
What do you think? If you understand the problem, you can tell me whether it avoids the problem.
What about changing the line to "In the pandemic time, a lot of
people,
organizations and educational institutes are communicating via
nonfree
video conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc "?
What do you think? If you understand the problem, you can tell me
whether
it avoids the problem.
Yes, it avoids the problem as it does not say that we are using nonfree software.
Please cite LibrePlanet first, for two reasons:
It used only free software in 2020 already.
It is a free software event, whereas FOSDEM is not.
What about we rephrase it as follows?
"We would like to highlight that an online conference hosted 30,000 participants using only free software (Matrix and Jitsi only) https://matrix.org/blog/2021/02/15/how-we-hosted-fosdem-2021-on-matrix/. It shows that for large conferences also we need not depend on proprietary software." without mentioning their name.
The point is to show that even large online conferences can be handled using only free software.
Ravi Dwivedi ravi@anche.no writes:
The point is to show that even large online conferences can be handled using only free software.
I think we can still introduce people to LibrePlanet. We can use all the information that is helpful to convince people and bringing more people on board.
-- Regards... Pankaj
I think we can still introduce people to LibrePlanet. We can use all the information that is helpful to convince people and bringing more people on board.
LibrePlanet is already mentioned in the article.
Ravi Dwivedi ravi@anche.no writes:
I think we can still introduce people to LibrePlanet. We can use all the information that is helpful to convince people and bringing more people on board.
LibrePlanet is already mentioned in the article.
Sorry for the confusion. My comment was specifically for the rephrased sentence.
Sorry for the confusion. My comment was specifically for the rephrased sentence.
Pankaj,
I would to request you to please write a rephrased version of the sentence here.
Ravi Dwivedi ravi@anche.no writes:
Sorry for the confusion. My comment was specifically for the rephrased sentence.
I would to request you to please write a rephrased version of the sentence here.
Something like this,
"We would like to highlight successful conferences like LibrePlanet which shows that for large conferences also we need not depend on proprietary software. Some conferences went on to host roughly 30,000 attendees without using any non-free software. Read https://matrix.org/blog/2021/02/15/how-we-hosted-fosdem-2021-on-matrix"
-- Regards... Pankaj
[[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
"We would like to highlight that an online conference hosted 30,000 participants using only free software (Matrix and Jitsi only) https://matrix.org/blog/2021/02/15/how-we-hosted-fosdem-2021-on-matrix/. It shows that for large conferences also we need not depend on proprietary software." without mentioning their name.
There's no need to hide the fact that it was FOSDEM. The old text about FOSDEM is basically good -- just please describe LibrePlanet first, FOSDEM second.
There's no need to hide the fact that it was FOSDEM. The old text about FOSDEM is basically good -- just please describe LibrePlanet first, FOSDEM second.
That has been done. Check https://fsf.org.in/article/better-than-zoom/.
Am I missing something? The article still uses the sentence: "In the pandemic time, our communications are being held via nonfreevideo conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc"
Thanks and regards, SS
Am I missing something? The article still uses the sentence: "In the
pandemic time, our communications are being held via nonfreevideo conferencing software like Zoom, Google Meet etc"
Yes, the article still says that. We have not settled on what should be the replacement of the phrase. We are discussing on it.
However, when I said that the changes have been made, I meant that the Libreplanet had been mentioned before FOSDEM as the following line in the article says:
"It is entirely possible to run large conferences online using free software. The FSF hosted its annual LibrePlanet 2020 and the FSF 35th anniversary event entirely online using free software and RYF hardware. The LibrePlanet conference has been live streamed to a worldwide audience since 2014. FOSDEM 2021 was hosted online to an audience of over 30K exclusively using free software." here https://fsf.org.in/article/better-than-zoom/
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Pankaj Jangid -
Ravi Dwivedi -
Richard Stallman -
Snehal M Shekatkar