Is this another way of saying that India was out in the cold till all this time?
Below is something I had written for LinuxJournal recently.
If so, would someone clarify why India was treated as untrustworthy till recently, and what has since changed? FN
-------------------------------------------- From an article published in early December in www.linuxjournal.com:
Microsoft has argued that its 'Shared Source Initiative' is "a balanced approach to broadly licensing source code while preserving the intellectual property (IP) rights needed to sustain a strong software business".
Interestingly, Microsoft's source code is "made available" only in some countries worldwide, depending, the company says, on "national laws, practices, enforcement policies and attitudes towards IP protection".
The Windows CE, Windows CE Academic Curriculum, and C#/JScript/CLI Implementations Shared Source Licensing Programs are available worldwide.
But enterprise, systems integrator, government and OEM source licensing programs are not available in India, according to Microsoft's official website accessed November 30.
Neither is the Microsoft Research Source Licensing Program.
"I tried digging the m$ site on Shared Source," responded Mahesh T. Pai, one of those discussing the issue with strong views in the commons of the Indian cyberspace.
Complained Pai: "I digged and digged and digged and digged and clicked on a link and clicked on another link which said 'more info' and clicked on link which said 'more info' and clicked on link which said 'more info' and ... there was more and more and more and more and more and more and more on 'benefits' of Shared Source; they told that you will get the access to the source code if you 'agree' but the license was not available to read."
"Shared source is another way of saying 'my code is my code; your code is our code'," Pai argued.
-------------------------------------------
On Fri, 13 Dec 2002, Ashish Kotamkar wrote:
Microsoft to share Windows code with India The Economic Times, India DECEMBER 13, 2002 http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/comp/articleshow?artid=3110 2968
Microsoft is virtually doing the unthinkable in India � it is planning to share the Windows source code. Not with one and all, as Linux does, but with a specific government body which, in turn, will share it with others for the purposes of e-governance and education.
Microsoft has already made a proposal to the ministry of information technology for sharing the Windows source code with one government body. The nature of the body has not been spelt out; it will presumably be worked out after discussions between the company and the government officials. Interestingly, the offer comes at a time when state governments are showing interest in rival Linux operating system as the latter's source code is free and downloadable from the internet.....
When contacted by ET, Microsoft India president Rajiv Nair was somewhat cagey. Although he didn't deny the move, he merely said, "We are evaluating the idea (of sharing the source code)." However, sources in the company said that MS is already in talks with the government to work out the modalities of sharing the source code. It's learnt that MS worldwide program manager for shared source program, Jason Matusow, was recently in India to work out the modalities.
Microsoft is exceedingly secretive about its Windows source code � the company has so far shared it with only a few big clients and developers. In Asia. MS has shared the Windows source code with select clients in Japan, Korea and Singapore. What appears to have persuaded it to extend the same privilege to the Indian government is the growing attraction here for the Linux OS, which is seen by some state governments as a cheaper alternative to Windows.
Microsoft officials are, of course, playing down the Linux threat. They insisted that Linux wasn't a big issue while selling to the governments in India. Says Peter Hayes, industry vice-president, Microsoft Government: "OS software is merely 1-3% of the total cost of an IT project, and studies have shown that total cost can be lower with Microsoft technologies compared to Linux." The open source software has been grabbing headlines recently asthe debate on open versus proprietary software has gained momentum in government circles here.
Says MS boss for shared source program, Jason Matusow, "There has been a lot of hype about open source code in the software industry as well as in the media. Linux might grab headlines, but being able to look at source code doesn't bring any benefits to an average end-user, though it might increase the trust level.�
The basic idea behind open source is very simple. When programmers can read, redistribute, and modify the source code for a piece of software, the software evolves. People improve it, people adapt it, people fix bugs. While open source community believes that this process produces better software than the traditional closed model, proponents of proprietary software argue that this model can't work in the commercial world.
=========================================================== Ashish Kotamkar (ashish@mithi.com) Mithi Software Technologies Pvt. Ltd. (www.mithi.com) Communicate in your own language. Log onto www.mailjol.com. ===========================================================
i know fred and a host of friends do not agree with me on this issue but i do believe that open source is not the most important issue in putting ict to development projects any more than knowing the recipe of coke will make a developing country rich.
what is important and critical is to understand how to envision, architect, design, develop, test,...and implement integrated systems in as much as is feasible with an understanding both of the needs and the technology and in that order.
open source debate is but a minor piece of the puzzle. of course the debate should continue. but just as making coca cola the plan of its government's policy did not help the first non-congress government in india (we lost another 14 years until a certain prime minister decided to open the economy instead) and the nation much, open source will not do very much more either.
thanks ________________________________ satish jha cmd, james martin & co www.jmcin.com president, digital partners india n-103, panchsheel park, new delhi - 110 017 v: 649 9384/5; 649 4384/5 f: 649 4380
----- Original Message ----- From: "Frederick Noronha" fred@bytesforall.org To: "Bytesforall_Readers" bytesforall_readers@yahoogroups.com Cc: linux-india-general@lists.sourceforge.net; fsf-friends@gnu.org.in Sent: Friday, December 13, 2002 5:00 PM Subject: Re: [bytesforall_readers] Microsoft to share Windows code with India
Is this another way of saying that India was out in the cold till all this time?
Below is something I had written for LinuxJournal recently.
If so, would someone clarify why India was treated as untrustworthy till recently, and what has since changed? FN
--------------------------------------------
From an article published in early December in www.linuxjournal.com:
Microsoft has argued that its 'Shared Source Initiative' is "a balanced approach to broadly licensing source code while preserving the intellectual property (IP) rights needed to sustain a strong software business".
Interestingly, Microsoft's source code is "made available" only in some countries worldwide, depending, the company says, on "national laws, practices, enforcement policies and attitudes towards IP protection".
The Windows CE, Windows CE Academic Curriculum, and C#/JScript/CLI Implementations Shared Source Licensing Programs are available worldwide.
But enterprise, systems integrator, government and OEM source licensing programs are not available in India, according to Microsoft's official website accessed November 30.
Neither is the Microsoft Research Source Licensing Program.
"I tried digging the m$ site on Shared Source," responded Mahesh T. Pai, one of those discussing the issue with strong views in the commons of the Indian cyberspace.
Complained Pai: "I digged and digged and digged and digged and clicked on a link and clicked on another link which said 'more info' and clicked on link which said 'more info' and clicked on link which said 'more info' and ... there was more and more and more and more and more and more and more on 'benefits' of Shared Source; they told that you will get the access to the source code if you 'agree' but the license was not available to read."
"Shared source is another way of saying 'my code is my code; your code is our code'," Pai argued.
-------------------------------------------
On Fri, 13 Dec 2002, Ashish Kotamkar wrote:
Microsoft to share Windows code with India The Economic Times, India DECEMBER 13, 2002
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/html/comp/articleshow?artid=3110
2968
Microsoft is virtually doing the unthinkable in India - it is planning to share the Windows source code. Not with one and all, as Linux does, but
with
a specific government body which, in turn, will share it with others for
the
purposes of e-governance and education.
Microsoft has already made a proposal to the ministry of information technology for sharing the Windows source code with one government body. T
he
nature of the body has not been spelt out; it will presumably be worked
out
after discussions between the company and the government officials. Interestingly, the offer comes at a time when state governments are
showing
interest in rival Linux operating system as the latter's source code is
free
and downloadable from the internet.....
When contacted by ET, Microsoft India president Rajiv Nair was somewhat cagey. Although he didn't deny the move, he merely said, "We are
evaluating
the idea (of sharing the source code)." However, sources in the company
said
that MS is already in talks with the government to work out the modalities of sharing the source code. It's learnt that MS worldwide program manager for shared source program, Jason Matusow, was recently in India to work
out
the modalities.
Microsoft is exceedingly secretive about its Windows source code - the company has so far shared it with only a few big clients and developers.
In
Asia. MS has shared the Windows source code with select clients in Japan, Korea and Singapore. What appears to have persuaded it to extend the same privilege to the Indian government is the growing attraction here for the Linux OS, which is seen by some state governments as a cheaper alternative to Windows.
Microsoft officials are, of course, playing down the Linux threat. They insisted that Linux wasn't a big issue while selling to the governments in India. Says Peter Hayes, industry vice-president, Microsoft Government:
"OS
software is merely 1-3% of the total cost of an IT project, and studies
have
shown that total cost can be lower with Microsoft technologies compared to Linux." The open source software has been grabbing headlines recently
asthe
debate on open versus proprietary software has gained momentum in
government
circles here.
Says MS boss for shared source program, Jason Matusow, "There has been a
lot
of hype about open source code in the software industry as well as in the media. Linux might grab headlines, but being able to look at source code doesn't bring any benefits to an average end-user, though it might
increase
the trust level."
The basic idea behind open source is very simple. When programmers can
read,
redistribute, and modify the source code for a piece of software, the software evolves. People improve it, people adapt it, people fix bugs.
While
open source community believes that this process produces better software than the traditional closed model, proponents of proprietary software
argue
that this model can't work in the commercial world.
=========================================================== Ashish Kotamkar (ashish@mithi.com) Mithi Software Technologies Pvt. Ltd. (www.mithi.com) Communicate in your own language. Log onto www.mailjol.com. ===========================================================
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"satish" == satish jha sjha@vsnl.com writes:
satish> i know fred and a host of friends do not agree with me on satish> this issue but i do believe that open source is not the satish> most important issue in putting ict to development satish> projects any more than knowing the recipe of coke will satish> make a developing country rich.
satish> what is important and critical is to understand how to satish> envision, architect, design, develop, test,...and satish> implement integrated systems in as much as is feasible satish> with an understanding both of the needs and the technology satish> and in that order.
Agreed. These are important factors in development and should be understood and nurtured.
satish> open source debate is but a minor piece of the puzzle. of satish> course the debate should continue. but just as making coca satish> cola the plan of its government's policy did not help the satish> first non-congress government in india (we lost another 14 satish> years until a certain prime minister decided to open the satish> economy instead) and the nation much, open source will not satish> do very much more either.
Not a sociologist or an economist, so unable to predict the effects of properly-deployed Free/Libre and Open Source Software (FLOSS) technologies on the level of development in India. Maybe deploying Linux nation-wide will have no effect at all on the poverty in the country. Nevertheless, I DO have enough insight to predict that if my country keeps buying and deploying software they don't need from a foreign corporation more of my country will be below the poverty line sooner rather than later.
Maybe it's a personal failing, but I can see no way by which using proprietary, locked-in software can do anything but widen the gap between haves and have-nots, make the poor more poor and act as a ever-widening conduit to leak money and resources from India.
In short, even if you don't accept FLOSS as a means to bridge any divides do accept it as a means to minimising those divides in the first place.
[I personally believe that appropriately-deployed FLOSS technology can actually help enable development and benefit every class of person in India. However I don't have facts and figures to back that up, so won't press the point. You are welcome to have your own take on it.]
Regards,
-- Raju
satish> [snip]
satish jha wrote:
... i do believe that open source is not the most important issue in putting ict to development projects ....
Exactly. You hit the nail right on the head. Open source (OS) is *not* important. What is important is _freedom_. Being OS'ed is only a means of ensuring freedom; one among many things required to preserve the users' swatantrata.
what is important and critical is to understand how to envision, architect, design, develop, test,...and implement integrated systems in as much as is feasible with an understanding both of the needs and the technology and in that order.
You left out the most important part - MAINTAIN.
(in the next paragraph, 'you' means the community, not Mr. Satish Jha) Merely being OS will not help you here. In development and e-governance projects, unlike the all uses to which ICT has been applied so far, the data requires to be preserved for a l o n g time. You need to be able to modify, alter, redistribute, and all that if you are to effectively use ICT over a period of time.
.... just as making coca cola ...
Speaking of cola, simply coz you know the formula to make that does not entitle you to manufacture it. Ditto with s/w. Merely knowing the sources does not mean freedom.
open source will not do very much more either.
Yes, OS will not. FREEDOM, swatantrata will. Unfortunately, some believe that by simply being OS, you are 'free', which unfortunately is not true.
Mahesh T. Pai.