Disclaimer: Long post with lots of in-line reply.
On Sun, Nov 27, 2011 at 8:51 PM, jtd@mtnl.net.in wrote:
On Sunday 27 November 2011 17:06:57 Dinesh Shah wrote:
On Nov 27, 2011, at 9:33, Binand Sethumadhavan binand@gmail.com wrote:
On 26 November 2011 23:09, Rony gnulinuxist@gmail.com wrote:
and I suppose that you also believe that you need to know how to drive in order to get a driving license?
Kill the wrong process not the purpose of it.
This is what we should do. Kill the wrong process, and implement a right one. Not build another process that is equally if not more flawed on top of it and then hope that these two wrong processes will cancel out each other.
Good. Now we should be able to make some headway. Experts here please suggest appropriate solution to this identity problem?
If we can provide an alternative and "correct" solution no one can deny to adopt that one!
Oh. Is the problem defined? Or do we proceed on the brain dead assumption that people dont have identities. Identity is one that I choose to identify myself as.
Agreed. But the identity YOU choose to be identified with should be acceptable to others with whom you would like to transact.
The state has no say in the matter.
What is state? The government? the geographically bounded region of earth? The Constitution? Laws? Customs? Culture? People?
The problem the state is trying to solve is wholly of it's own invention. Which is to selectively channelise resources to it's choosen ones.
Agreed. Caste/Religion based reservation is shining example of that.
Why does one need a freaking ration card to buy ration when trillions of tons of food lies rotting. Not to mention the cattle quality starvation quantity dished out in he PDS.
Agreed.
Why do I need proof of identity to open a bank account with my money, on which the bank profits.
Will you allow me to open a bank account in your name and do any kind of transactions in that account?
Why does a small borrower need hundreds of docs to borrow from a bank, when trillions of Rs. of loans to sakhar karkhanas are written off?
Precisely. You literally need tons of paper to get any thing done in this country.
Why do I need proof of identity to enter a death trap known as public health service, as though the government was conferring luxury services.
Without this how will you recover your health insurance money? you have a health insurance right? :-)
Why do I need proof to buy a freakin cell phone connection. OH oh Security.
So is it OK to buy a cell phone in your name make obscene calls to these cute girls in my neighbourhood? :-)
Never mind that bombs go off as and when the bombers please and the cops get rapped in court for fake encounters.
Agreed.
Talk of manufacturing solutions to non existent problems. Cart, horse etc.
???
Just get off this nonsense of people not having identity. The state wants to target selectively groups it may wish to confer benefits on or supress. Hence this manufactured need.
That already exist in the form of caste and religion based reservation system so why complain against UID? At least they are not saying they will only issue ID to select people of select caste and/or religion or economic groups.
The so called leakages stem from the fact that the qualification criteria for PDS, health and other entitlements are pegged so low that huge swathes of our people who should be actually entitled to these services are denied that.
Agreed.
Not because they dont have identity,
Well?
but because the state chooses to play a cynical vote / power channelling game.
Agreed.
The ones who can "afford" better services already avail of them by paying top dollars. The utterly inhumane Rs.32/- per day per person is a case in point.
Indeed. This is most ridiculous thing to do.
It angers me no end that the richest professionals in the country along with the government are riding on the backs of the poor, without the slightest thought to the above mentioned reasons.
Are you referring to UAIDA or all other professionals?
Foisting a wholly artificial and manufactured "identity crisis", and plastering onto that all sorts of panaceas for corruption, poverty elevation, rural employment, banking etc.
That is the mis-sell on part of the Govt. and UAIDA. They should have limited their scope and role to just providing the Unique ID.
Not a single study has been undertaken to show that identity is the problem.
But do you agree that having plethora of IDs is a problem? Or even no study have been conducted for that issue either?
Infact existing studies show that it is the native power structures and arbitrary rules that have caused the problem. Yet we insist on keeping the arbitrary rules in place and spending humongous amounts of money to climb those artificial barriers, instead of demolishing and flattening those barriers, providing equal universal access to basic neccessities of food clothes, medicine, education etc.
Agreed. How can we help remove those arbitrary rules? Remember that all existing rules and laws are framed and passed by our "honourable" elected representatives. (MPs, MLAs, etc.)
One does not need a name to eat or learn or be nursed back to health.
Agreed. But in a society we need more than that and you can not avail (lawfully) of any if people in your society/community does not know you.
But one does require steely resolve to bring ones self out of ones glass tower and stand with the poorest of the poor.
How? By becoming poor?
The last few persons to do that were M. K. Gandhi and Dr. B. R. Ambedkar. One would do well to read carefully their views on our society and understand the burden of identity amongst the poor.
I have sure read MKG but not Dr. BRA. May be it's time I pick some books by/on Dr. BRA.
However, we are still not near providing any "concrete" solution in place of UID. At least they claim they have some goal and vision to reaching out to those poorest of poor and help them. What are we offering? (except spending time on discussing endlessly the futility of UID)?
Can we, as community (Free/Open Source) offer something credible?
With regards,