Hello,
The Ubuntu 10.04 32 bit installation in my system works fine except for one basic flaw that the display crashes on any higher load, like opening many applications etc. The crash requires the system to be forced shut down and restarted. It happens suddenly in the middle of some work. There is no xorg.conf in the X11 directory and on the net many others too have reported facing this problem with older 845 mobos. There is no text based or gui control to adjust display related settings like refresh rate etc. As with other modern distros before it, it appears that slowly Linux is going the Windows way where the simple text file configuration is being replaced by system automated processes and the user is loosing control of his system unless he/she is an advanced expert. At least in Windows there are GUIs for hardware setups to replace or update drivers.
Ubuntu appears to be too interested in racing ahead of other distros even at the cost of stability. This makes the Ubuntu system good for Beta testers and as a latest toy but not good for serious users. There should be some automated benchmarking software that tests their distros on various machines and reports problems, in simulated conditions. That way they don't have to depend only on filed bug reports to correct problems. For a change, I downloaded the Fedora 12 live + install CD and it looks quite good. Ubuntu 10.04 uses the 2.6.32 kernel and Fedora 12 uses 2.6.31, very close. The live CD boots fine with 512 MB RAM. Its installation was the fastest I've seen as it simply copies the entire cd image to the hard disk, reboots and then adds new users. This live CD installs only on Ext4 partitions. It comes with gnome and has no OpenOffice. I took the opportunity to download Oxygen Office 3 and installed its rpms. OxygenOffice has better compatibility with Office2007 files.
http://linux.softpedia.com/progDownload/OxygenOffice-Professional-Download-3...
After un-taring the folder, simply go to the RPMS folder and run 'rpm -i *.rpm' (as root) to install everything. Then go to the menus subfolder in RPMS and install the Red Hat rpm, to create the menu icons.
In both the distros Google Earth crashes in my Intel 845 mobo with a requirement for a forced restart. In Fedora12, the display goes not get garbled, it simply freezes. However Google earth works fine in my Acer Laptop with 915 chipset and Lenny. However due to its 256 MB RAM, its painfully slow.
Like Vista and Windows 7, it looks like those who want to use the latest Linux distros will have to upgrade their systems for better stability and display support.
Regards,
Rony.
On Sunday 16 May 2010 21:54:14 Rony wrote:
Hello,
There is no xorg.conf in the X11 directory
Xorg -configure
or simply copy an existing one to /etc/X11/. X will use it and overide automatic settings if it exists.
and on the net many others too have reported facing this problem with older 845 mobos.
There is no text based or gui control to adjust display related settings like refresh rate etc.
With kdm, the control center - peripherals - display settings. Gnome has something similiar.
As with other modern distros before it, it appears that slowly Linux
You mean ubuntu?.
is going the Windows way where the simple text file configuration is being replaced by system automated processes and the user is loosing control of his system unless he/she is an advanced expert. At least in Windows there are GUIs for hardware setups to replace or update drivers.
Not quite. With linux distros the text conf files continue to exists and will over ride the app defaults. BTW i hate the gconf madness.
Ubuntu appears to be too interested in racing ahead of other distros even at the cost of stability. This makes the Ubuntu system good for Beta testers and as a latest toy but not good for serious users.
Ubuntu is debian unstable + testing. So it is going to be unstable in exchange for the latest. Use debian stable + backports + self compiled (and self tested).
There should be some automated benchmarking software that tests their distros on various machines and reports problems, in simulated conditions. That way they don't have to depend only on filed bug reports to correct problems.
Hardware in India are not the same as available elsewhere. Consequently there is no alternative to thorough selftest.
For a change, I downloaded the Fedora 12 live + install CD and it looks quite good. Ubuntu 10.04 uses the 2.6.32 kernel and Fedora 12 uses 2.6.31, very close. The live CD boots fine with 512 MB RAM. Its installation was the fastest I've seen as it simply copies the entire cd image to the hard disk, reboots and then adds new users. This live CD installs only on Ext4 partitions. It comes with gnome and has no OpenOffice. I took the opportunity to download Oxygen Office 3 and installed its rpms. OxygenOffice has better compatibility with Office2007 files.
In both the distros Google Earth crashes in my Intel 845 mobo with a requirement for a forced restart. In Fedora12, the display goes not get garbled, it simply freezes. However Google earth works fine in my Acer Laptop with 915 chipset and Lenny. However due to its 256 MB RAM, its painfully slow.
Afaik googlearth requires atleast 2D acceleration and hughe amounts of ram. So i845 boards wont work anyway. A reasonable comparison would be to test GE on doze, then linux on a 845.
Like Vista and Windows 7, it looks like those who want to use the latest Linux distros will have to upgrade their systems for better stability and display support.
Using unstable wont make a difference to stability on any hardware. If you use 2d/3d accel apps, you must use 2d/3d accel hardware.
On Monday 17 May 2010 01:53 PM, jtd wrote:
On Sunday 16 May 2010 21:54:14 Rony wrote:
Hello,
There is no xorg.conf in the X11 directory
Xorg -configure
sudo: xorg: command not found
or simply copy an existing one to /etc/X11/. X will use it and overide automatic settings if it exists.
and on the net many others too have reported facing this problem with older 845 mobos.
There is no text based or gui control to adjust display related settings like refresh rate etc.
With kdm, the control center - peripherals - display settings. Gnome has something similiar.
It has preset values that you cannot change.
As with other modern distros before it, it appears that slowly Linux
You mean ubuntu?.
Looks more like Ubuntu. I am trying out the Fedora 12 to see how that runs.
is going the Windows way where the simple text file configuration is being replaced by system automated processes and the user is loosing control of his system unless he/she is an advanced expert. At least in Windows there are GUIs for hardware setups to replace or update drivers.
Not quite. With linux distros the text conf files continue to exists and will over ride the app defaults. BTW i hate the gconf madness.
At some office I was giving a demo in printer sharing and booted 2 systems with Ubuntus but there was no dhcp server so static ips had to be given. There was no provision for that in the default network manager. Even after editing the network connection manually by GUI, the network manager did not respond with a connection. I edited the interfaces file and got both machines to ping each other but they simply refused to get talking in the GUI. The longer process is to replace NetworkManager with wicd but it is a nuisance.
Ubuntu appears to be too interested in racing ahead of other distros even at the cost of stability. This makes the Ubuntu system good for Beta testers and as a latest toy but not good for serious users.
Ubuntu is debian unstable + testing. So it is going to be unstable in exchange for the latest. Use debian stable + backports + self compiled (and self tested).
Ubuntu 9.04 was a nice distro and ahead of Lenny when it came out but it was quite decent in usage and stability.
There should be some automated benchmarking software that tests their distros on various machines and reports problems, in simulated conditions. That way they don't have to depend only on filed bug reports to correct problems.
Hardware in India are not the same as available elsewhere. Consequently there is no alternative to thorough selftest.
For a change, I downloaded the Fedora 12 live + install CD and it looks quite good. Ubuntu 10.04 uses the 2.6.32 kernel and Fedora 12 uses 2.6.31, very close. The live CD boots fine with 512 MB RAM. Its installation was the fastest I've seen as it simply copies the entire cd image to the hard disk, reboots and then adds new users. This live CD installs only on Ext4 partitions. It comes with gnome and has no OpenOffice. I took the opportunity to download Oxygen Office 3 and installed its rpms. OxygenOffice has better compatibility with Office2007 files.
In both the distros Google Earth crashes in my Intel 845 mobo with a requirement for a forced restart. In Fedora12, the display goes not get garbled, it simply freezes. However Google earth works fine in my Acer Laptop with 915 chipset and Lenny. However due to its 256 MB RAM, its painfully slow.
Afaik googlearth requires atleast 2D acceleration and hughe amounts of ram. So i845 boards wont work anyway. A reasonable comparison would be to test GE on doze, then linux on a 845.
I will do that and report back.
Like Vista and Windows 7, it looks like those who want to use the latest Linux distros will have to upgrade their systems for better stability and display support.
Using unstable wont make a difference to stability on any hardware. If you use 2d/3d accel apps, you must use 2d/3d accel hardware.
What I've noticed is that all these distro kernels are compiled in a customised way so they are different form each other though their version may be the same. This brings variety but also adds to the problems. Some work just beautifully and some give a lot of trouble.
On Monday 17 May 2010 22:48:26 Rony wrote:
On Monday 17 May 2010 01:53 PM, jtd wrote:
On Sunday 16 May 2010 21:54:14 Rony wrote:
Hello,
There is no xorg.conf in the X11 directory
Xorg -configure
sudo: xorg: command not found
its Xorg (capital). Infact you can customize everything using Xorg.
or simply copy an existing one to /etc/X11/. X will use it and overide automatic settings if it exists.
and on the net many others too have reported facing this problem with older 845 mobos.
There is no text based or gui control to adjust display related settings like refresh rate etc.
With kdm, the control center - peripherals - display settings. Gnome has something similiar.
It has preset values that you cannot change.
You have to run it as root.
As with other modern distros before it, it appears that slowly Linux
You mean ubuntu?.
Looks more like Ubuntu. I am trying out the Fedora 12 to see how that runs.
is going the Windows way where the simple text file configuration is being replaced by system automated processes and the user is loosing control of his system unless he/she is an advanced expert. At least in Windows there are GUIs for hardware setups to replace or update drivers.
Not quite. With linux distros the text conf files continue to exists and will over ride the app defaults. BTW i hate the gconf madness.
At some office I was giving a demo in printer sharing and booted 2 systems with Ubuntus but there was no dhcp server so static ips had to be given. There was no provision for that in the default network manager. Even after editing the network connection manually by GUI, the network manager did not respond with a connection. I edited the interfaces file and got both machines to ping each other but they simply refused to get talking in the GUI. The longer process is to replace NetworkManager with wicd but it is a nuisance.
Ubuntu appears to be too interested in racing ahead of other distros even at the cost of stability. This makes the Ubuntu system good for Beta testers and as a latest toy but not good for serious users.
Ubuntu is debian unstable + testing. So it is going to be unstable in exchange for the latest. Use debian stable + backports + self compiled (and self tested).
Ubuntu 9.04 was a nice distro and ahead of Lenny when it came out but it was quite decent in usage and stability.
There should be some automated benchmarking software that tests their distros on various machines and reports problems, in simulated conditions. That way they don't have to depend only on filed bug reports to correct problems.
Hardware in India are not the same as available elsewhere. Consequently there is no alternative to thorough selftest.
For a change, I downloaded the Fedora 12 live + install CD and it looks quite good. Ubuntu 10.04 uses the 2.6.32 kernel and Fedora 12 uses 2.6.31, very close. The live CD boots fine with 512 MB RAM. Its installation was the fastest I've seen as it simply copies the entire cd image to the hard disk, reboots and then adds new users. This live CD installs only on Ext4 partitions. It comes with gnome and has no OpenOffice. I took the opportunity to download Oxygen Office 3 and installed its rpms. OxygenOffice has better compatibility with Office2007 files.
In both the distros Google Earth crashes in my Intel 845 mobo with a requirement for a forced restart. In Fedora12, the display goes not get garbled, it simply freezes. However Google earth works fine in my Acer Laptop with 915 chipset and Lenny. However due to its 256 MB RAM, its painfully slow.
Afaik googlearth requires atleast 2D acceleration and hughe amounts of ram. So i845 boards wont work anyway. A reasonable comparison would be to test GE on doze, then linux on a 845.
I will do that and report back.
Like Vista and Windows 7, it looks like those who want to use the latest Linux distros will have to upgrade their systems for better stability and display support.
Using unstable wont make a difference to stability on any hardware. If you use 2d/3d accel apps, you must use 2d/3d accel hardware.
What I've noticed is that all these distro kernels are compiled in a customised way so they are different form each other though their version may be the same. This brings variety but also adds to the problems. Some work just beautifully and some give a lot of trouble.
One of the reasons to stick with debian.
2010/5/17 Rony gnulinuxist@gmail.com:
On Monday 17 May 2010 01:53 PM, jtd wrote:
On Sunday 16 May 2010 21:54:14 Rony wrote:
Hello,
There is no xorg.conf in the X11 directory
Xorg -configure
sudo: xorg: command not found
that's Xorg, with a capital X.
Anurag
I agree with OP with Ubuntu going doze way. After 3-4 years of solid releases, Ubuntu has gone down hill since 9.04. As end user what I need is stability and then features.
On Tue, May 18, 2010 at 9:24 AM, Anurag anurag@gnuer.org wrote:
2010/5/17 Rony gnulinuxist@gmail.com:
On Monday 17 May 2010 01:53 PM, jtd wrote:
On Sunday 16 May 2010 21:54:14 Rony wrote:
Hello,
There is no xorg.conf in the X11 directory
Xorg -configure
sudo: xorg: command not found
that's Xorg, with a capital X.
Anurag
-- http://web.gnuer.org/ -- http://mm.glug-bom.org/mailman/listinfo/linuxers
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 11:54 AM, Piyush Ranjan piyush.pr@gmail.com wrote:
I agree with OP with Ubuntu going doze way. After 3-4 years of solid releases, Ubuntu has gone down hill since 9.04. As end user what I need is stability and then features.
What do you mean by 'stability' ?
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 11:57 AM, sankarshan < sankarshan.mukhopadhyay@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 11:54 AM, Piyush Ranjan piyush.pr@gmail.com wrote:
I agree with OP with Ubuntu going doze way. After 3-4 years of solid releases, Ubuntu has gone down hill since 9.04. As end user what I need
is
stability and then features.
Sounds like Debian.
Regards, Easwar Registered Linux user #442065
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 12:12 PM, Piyush Ranjan piyush.pr@gmail.com wrote:
Easwar Registered Linux user #442065
Wait! is that serious ? LOLz :P
isn't it obvious ? No crashing of X server, No system crashes, should boot first time without messing around with fstab with that UUID bull, faster than last release. faster mysql without any write barriers (it is present in newer ubuntu releases and makes MySQL dog slow)
There are a few things that are better though boot time, better hardware support, looks etc.
May be it is time for a new distro.
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 11:57 AM, sankarshan < sankarshan.mukhopadhyay@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 11:54 AM, Piyush Ranjan piyush.pr@gmail.com wrote:
I agree with OP with Ubuntu going doze way. After 3-4 years of solid releases, Ubuntu has gone down hill since 9.04. As end user what I need
is
stability and then features.
What do you mean by 'stability' ?
-- sankarshan mukhopadhyay
http://sankarshan.randomink.org/blog/
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 12:11 PM, Piyush Ranjan piyush.pr@gmail.com wrote:
isn't it obvious ?
It wasn't but I did find your list below helpful.
No crashing of X server, No system crashes, should boot first time without messing around with fstab with that UUID bull, faster than last release. faster mysql without any write barriers (it is present in newer ubuntu releases and makes MySQL dog slow)
So, how do you propose that each of the above indicators of stability be developed, tested and deployed in a distribution with a reasonably fast release cycle ?
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 12:25 PM, Piyush Ranjan piyush.pr@gmail.com wrote:
So, how do you propose that each of the above indicators of stability be developed, tested and deployed in a distribution with a reasonably fast release cycle ?
I don't! I'd just switch to a more stable release ...won't I ?
Stay with LTS release in this case or as Easwar rightly pointed, stay with Debian Stable. (no flames please as obviously I can not suggest anything else ;))
On Wednesday 19 May 2010 12:16 PM, sankarshan wrote:
No crashing of X server, No system crashes, should boot first time without messing around with fstab with that UUID bull, faster than last release. faster mysql without any write barriers (it is present in newer ubuntu releases and makes MySQL dog slow)
So, how do you propose that each of the above indicators of stability be developed, tested and deployed in a distribution with a reasonably fast release cycle ?
That is the whole point. We don't need frequent _upgrades_. Ubuntu should stick to frequent _updates_ . Otherwise Ubuntu will only end up as a toy. If a distro does not even last 6 months before it is replaced, it is not for serious users. Debian is good no doubt but something in between Debian and Ubuntu is needed.
well what about arch and gentoo even sidux (which is basically debian sid).. they can go on forever without being "replaced". The target audience for ubuntu is new comers which is becoming more and more obvious with each release. I for instance started using linux with Hardy heron and i have since moved on to ... more "fun" distrubutions like gentoo and arch.
Yohan
hmm..I should give arch a try. Have heard good things about pacman or is it packman ?
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 11:37 PM, Yohan Pereira yohan.pereira@gmail.comwrote:
well what about arch and gentoo even sidux (which is basically debian sid).. they can go on forever without being "replaced". The target audience for ubuntu is new comers which is becoming more and more obvious with each release. I for instance started using linux with Hardy heron and i have since moved on to ... more "fun" distrubutions like gentoo and arch.
Yohan
its pacman. An another intresting thing is /etc/rc.conf youll see it during the installation. Yohan
I was gonna suggest Arch... problem is its not that very stable and its kernel is far ahead of ubuntu as well.
It is a perfect control system, for the heavy hacker who wants to control every bit of his OS. It depends a lot of the txt conf files.
Regards,
*Sanket Shah *India Email: 88.sanket@gmail.com On 20 May 2010 00:08, Yohan Pereira yohan.pereira@gmail.com wrote:
its pacman. An another intresting thing is /etc/rc.conf youll see it during the installation. Yohan -- http://mm.glug-bom.org/mailman/listinfo/linuxers
On Wed, May 19, 2010 at 11:37 PM, Yohan Pereira yohan.pereira@gmail.comwrote:
well what about arch and gentoo even sidux (which is basically debian sid).. they can go on forever without being "replaced".
With Sidux it is recommended to do "dist-upgrade" ideally once a week and at least once a month. http://manual.sidux.com/en/sys-admin-apt-en.htm#apt-upgrade
With *buntu you need that every six months or eighteen months in case of LTS
Regards Aseem
On Friday 21 May 2010 05:10 PM, Aseem Rane wrote:
With *buntu you need that every six months or eighteen months in case of LTS
In eighteen months does the distro automatically update to the latest packages that are there in the successor distro? IMHO, it does not.
On Friday 21 May 2010 21:57:37 Rony wrote:
On Friday 21 May 2010 05:10 PM, Aseem Rane wrote:
With *buntu you need that every six months or eighteen months in case of LTS
In eighteen months does the distro automatically update to the latest packages that are there in the successor distro? IMHO, it does not.
Afaik yes. aptitude is set by default to update automagically. Which imo is a pita.
GNU/Linux ! No Viruses No Spyware Only Freedom.
On Saturday 22 May 2010 10:32 AM, jtd wrote:
On Friday 21 May 2010 21:57:37 Rony wrote:
On Friday 21 May 2010 05:10 PM, Aseem Rane wrote:
With *buntu you need that every six months or eighteen months in case of LTS
In eighteen months does the distro automatically update to the latest packages that are there in the successor distro? IMHO, it does not.
Afaik yes. aptitude is set by default to update automagically. Which imo is a pita.
They are not the same packages as in the distros released later. That is why the need to upgrade to the higher distro. If they could find some way to automatically update the current distro to the same package versions as the newer distro, it would be very useful and remove the current headaches.
On Wednesday 19 May 2010 12:11:13 Piyush Ranjan wrote:
isn't it obvious ? No crashing of X server, No system crashes, should boot first time without messing around with fstab with that UUID bull, faster than last release. faster mysql without any write barriers (it is present in newer ubuntu releases and makes MySQL dog slow)
Debian stable is jut that - totally stable. My installations have stopped only on hardware failures. Usually disks, the occasional psu and rarely ram. avg uptime 4.5yrs
On Wednesday 19 May 2010 05:37 PM, jtd wrote:
On Wednesday 19 May 2010 12:11:13 Piyush Ranjan wrote:
isn't it obvious ? No crashing of X server, No system crashes, should boot first time without messing around with fstab with that UUID bull, faster than last release. faster mysql without any write barriers (it is present in newer ubuntu releases and makes MySQL dog slow)
Debian stable is jut that - totally stable. My installations have stopped only on hardware failures. Usually disks, the occasional psu and rarely ram. avg uptime 4.5yrs
I must add one point about Debian that its kernel is much ahead of Cent OS which is the Red Hat stable.
On Monday 17 May 2010 01:53 PM, jtd wrote:
On Sunday 16 May 2010 21:54:14 Rony wrote:
In both the distros Google Earth crashes in my Intel 845 mobo with a requirement for a forced restart. In Fedora12, the display goes not get garbled, it simply freezes. However Google earth works fine in my Acer Laptop with 915 chipset and Lenny. However due to its 256 MB RAM, its painfully slow.
Afaik googlearth requires atleast 2D acceleration and hughe amounts of ram. So i845 boards wont work anyway. A reasonable comparison would be to test GE on doze, then linux on a 845.
Google Earth installed fine in my Doze partition and works well.
-
Anurag -
Aseem Rane -
Easwar Hariharan -
jtd -
Kartik Mistry -
Piyush Ranjan -
Puneeth Chaganti -
Rony -
sankarshan -
Sanket Shah -
Yohan Pereira